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Greinke to Brewers, vetoes Nats?

Dec 19, 2010, 4:21 PM EST

Zack Greinke is now a Brewer, though perhaps only after coming very close to becoming a National.

The Royals agreed this morning to trade their ace right-hander (plus shortstop Yuniesky Betancourt and $2 million) to Milwaukee for four players: center fielder Lorenzo Cain, shortstop Alcides Escobar, right-hander Jake Odorizzi and a pitcher-to-be-named (believed to be Jeremy Jeffress). That ends months of speculation about Greinke trade rumors, and whether the Nationals could find a way to land the 27-year-old former Cy Young Award winner.

The Nats most certainly made a legitimate effort to acquire Greinke. And, according to's Jon Heyman, they were even close to striking a deal that would have sent Drew Storen, Danny Espinosa and others to Kansas City. Greinke, though, vetoed that potential deal, as was his right since the Nationals were one of 15 clubs in his no-trade clause.

That, of course, was a major reason why Greinke-to-D.C. was always a long shot. After seven seasons toiling away for a Royals club that surpassed 70 wins only once, Greinke wanted a chance to contend now. Whether Milwaukee has the talent now to overtake the Reds and Cardinals in the NL Central remains to be seen. But the Brewers have a better chance of winning in 2011 and 2012 than the Nationals, at least in Greinke's mind, so that's why he'll be wearing blue and gold onRead more »

  1. Anonymous - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:24 PM

    Oh well.

  2. nitchell - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:28 PM

    Wow, that's a fabulous trade for Kansas City. The Royals are going to be just loaded in 2012. Several great drafts and an actual plan will do that for you.

  3. Section 223 - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:28 PM

    I think this is a case of no deal is the best deal. I believe our infield defense is much better with Espinosa. I like Desmond's range and when he gets to the point of feeling he doesn't have to make every play that comes his way, we should have a solid 2nd, SS, and 3rd. Looks like we are going to zero in on Lee and that's fine. It shouldn't take more than a 2 year contract. I also think this will be a breakout year for J Zimm.Oh, and I love my newspaper delivery every day. It gives me more context on a lot of issues than just targeting what I might think I'm interested in on a particular website.

  4. JayB - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:33 PM

    300 Loses in 3 years and tradition of dysfunctional front office from keeping Jimbo through Stan quitting is hard to shake….you will recall I had warned that this would be a major problem back in 2007/8/9/10…..and it is the biggest issue facing the team….lack of spending and micro managing created the problem….over spending and getting out of the way of Rizzo is the only way to fix it.

  5. Doc - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:37 PM

    Time will tell, as comparisons will be made over the ensuing seasons, but it looks good for KC. Greinke will help the Brew Crew more than he could have helped the Nats, even if they gave up a lot. The Brewers are deeper on offense than the Nats, and could afford to do a trade like this.The Nats farm system needs to get deeper before a trade like that makes sense for them. Give it a year, and the Nats will be in a better position to make a trade like that without creating holes in the roster that can't be filled.

  6. JayB - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:43 PM

    Like I said back in Oct and Dec….this is why they had to make bold moves early….Vasquez and Del a Rosa….those were big misses and ones they could not afford to lose out on. They are going to have to spend %50 more than anyone else to dig out of this hole

  7. TominAshburn - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:48 PM

    I'm glad the deal didn't go through. I gave up newspapers for the internet a while ago. I don't miss having all those papers around the house, and having to deal with recycling them.

  8. Section 223 - Dec 19, 2010 at 4:51 PM

    It isn't a miss if a player just isn't going to sign with us this go around. Overpaying for Werth was a strategic move. Overpaying for everyone we covet in any particular year is a tactical move that will cause problems down the road. I think Rizzo is being quite aggressive without being irresponsible.

  9. JayB - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:04 PM

    Have a strategic plan and funding it and then failing to follow through on the tactical strategy is a recipe for more losing. They created the problem of Nats as losertown…they have to fix it by following through on the tactical stuff….if not then what is the point of Werth?.

  10. Todd Boss - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:06 PM

    Agree with Zuckerman's assertion that our offer may have been too much, despite the risk of overvaluing our prospects could be. Posted thoughts here : Nats are probably one season and one player (Strasburg) away from really being in the conversations with guys like Greinke frankly. We'll get there. Its a slow process.

  11. Section 223 - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:10 PM

    I think I see your point. I guess I was mainly thinking of a player like De la Roza. From his standpoint I would think it made sense to stay with a team that was in division contention almost to the end. They are trying to lock up their best players to long-term deals.As we have seen with Cliff Lee, money alone isn't going to get it. The Nats have indeed had the deserved reputation as a nowhere team over the last five years, but that is changing. The change won't happen all at one time, though. A big free agent here, homegrown player there, a middle of the road finish this year and who knows what next year might bring. Big money offers and tangible results from the previous year will probably keep us in the mix on coveted free agents in the future.

  12. N. Cognito - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:17 PM

    The world is coming to an end and it's all the Lerner's fault.Repeat and rinse.

  13. Golfersal - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:18 PM

    Honestly this guy is not the type of guy you want on your team. What I mean, he is he is a great pitcher and could be the best but he has had bouts of mental instability and signs of paranoid tenancies. Mark I have to wonder why not many in the media wrote about this problem? Is the media too scared to write about mental instabilty? That is the reason you never saw a big team in a big market like the Yankess or the Dodgers or the Angeles go after him. They were all afraid that he wouldn't be able to handle the fan and media scrutiny.He will be perfect for a small town like Milwaukee, that have kind fans and very little national media scurinty. The Washington area has had enough drama with players like Haynesworth and Areana who have experienced problems in making the right mental judgements and now McNabb, who is mentally sane and a great guy, but he is dealing with a management that has been totally insane now for over a decade.As much as I will miss not having Greinke on the Nats, maybe it was best that he used his option to end any possible deal with the Nats. I really am looking forward to watching Espinosa, Ian Desmond, Jordan Zimmermann and Storen grow into great players in the coming years and feel that if we can get some good pitching out of Wang and Marquis we could get it up past the 500 mark and be a contender for a wild card (nobody is going to beat the Phillies in the next three years) spot.

  14. N. Cognito - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:18 PM

    Doh! That should be "rinse and repeat.

  15. Water23 - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:21 PM

    Doc…You got it right, in another year our farm system will be better and the draft option better but the team will lose another 90+ games. Have less STHs and fewer FAs will consider joining the Pirates uhhh I mean Nats. Now, I am not saying this was the right deal but being a perennial loser has implications.

  16. raymitten - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:32 PM

    I'm not that upset about this — bottom line is that if the guy didn't want to play here, I didn't want him here. He isn't a lock — he had one outstanding year, but also was very down last year and has history of depression. Would he have lasted in '12 or whenever the Nats are 'big market' with Stras and Harper on the big club? And I agree trading Jordan Z for him doesn't make much sense. But I think Grienke's unwillingnexx to come here is, in part, Dunn fallout. Adam Dunn was the first 'star' free agent that ever came here, vocally wanted to stay at a reaonsable price and was let go. This builds a reputation of cheapness for the club which is hard to shake. Thank God Werth wanted to come here. Werth has helped alleviate the stigma to some degree, but more is going to have to happen positive here for this to ultimately turn around. Hanging on to a 'cheap' tag and angering the fan base seems a high cost for that fourth year on the Dunn contract to me.

  17. sec 3 my sofa - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:36 PM

    It's not even a given that over-spending will work, on a given deal. Apparently, Cliff Lee decided that being filthy rich was good enough, he didn't need to be filthy *stinkin* rich, and signed with the team he preferred, leaving enough NYY money on the table to PO the union. But money is what they have–not abundant prospects, and not abundant patience or time.Sometimes, when you've really pooched yourself, there is no way out–and you're like an a jackass in a hailstorm–nothing to do but stand there and take it.

  18. Mark - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:41 PM

    So many rational comments on not succumbing to the urge to make a deal for the sake of making a deal. Espinosa has what it takes and some bright people on this blog have said he has Gold Glove ability at 2nd base.I am a big Lorenzo Cain fan so I think just with him the Royals got 6 years in CF sewn up and for the long run the better deal.Also Greinke will be available in 2 years so we will see how he is when Free Agency arrives.

  19. SpotsyNats - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:44 PM

    The juice wasn't worth the squeeze. I'm glad the trade didn't happen with the Nats involved. I think we're much better off and we would have a head case with an attitude on our hands and more holes to fill. Enjoy the Brats, Zack!

  20. sec3 - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:53 PM

    Not surprising that when supply is down and demand is high, prices go up. But there's a psychology to it, too. After missing on Lee–who, 2 months ago, everybody said was the only true ace available–there's a strong tendency to over-value what's left. And ironically, Lee won't even be the #1 starter now.

  21. Anonymous - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:54 PM

    Having followed the Royals for the last year on a local AM station (in Nebraska), I think the Brewers are going to end up with buyer's remorse sooner than later. Grienke was apparently a handful. Not a favorite of the KC broadcasters at any rate. There were ongoing questions and comments about his work ethic and commitment.fpcsteve

  22. BinM - Dec 19, 2010 at 5:55 PM

    One way to de-construct the trade is Greinke for three players (Cain, Jeffress & Odorizzi); The shortstops (Escobar for Betancourt) & $2M are technically a wash. This almost looks like a 'salary-dump', forced by Greinke's request for a trade. If Moore was actually asking for JZimm, Espinosa & Storen, that was too much for WSH to surrender, imo. The equivalent players to the final trade would have been closer to Bernadina, Espinosa, Storen & Peacock with Greinke & maybe Ka'aihue in return.

  23. Anonymous - Dec 19, 2010 at 6:01 PM

    There's Garza, Ricky Nolasco … but in the end they might have to draft those pitchers attempting to make up for the draft mistakes made by Bowden and company.THAY JayB is why the Nats find themselves in this hole. Look at the Tampa Bay Rays. They basically used almost all draft picks to build a contender that beat the Yankees for the division title. Now, because they have and will lose so many free agents they will again have up to 8 picks between the first and second rounds.Imagine high eight picks in the hands of Rizzo and Roy Clark et al? I agree with the consensus here. Its better that the trade didn't happen. Best thing for Rizzo is to find a way to sign Derrick Lee and Brandon Webb. AZ wants too much for Upton otherwise if they could get him and play Morse at first. They are probably going to have to find a way to win with what they have in order to get to the rich crop of free agents in 2012. Plus there's a bumper crop draft in 2011. They may not have as many picks as the Rays but they may have enough to make a difference.

  24. Anonymous - Dec 19, 2010 at 6:04 PM

    It doesn't matter what Rizzo offered … Greinke vetoed the trade. Thank god former shortstop Guzman didn't do that last summer.

  25. JaneB - Dec 19, 2010 at 6:17 PM

    I'm glad this didn't this happen — Drew Storen and Danny Espinosa and Jordan Zimmerman are too much to give away. We need them. I guess that's why we got the Oakland pitcher, so they could trade Drew. Rock and a hard place….

  26. natscan reduxit - Dec 19, 2010 at 6:26 PM

    " … since the Nationals were one of 15 clubs in his no-trade clause."… to my way of thinking, that just means the Nats dodged a bullet, albeit a bullet thrown by a pretty good arm.Go Nats!

  27. Anonymous - Dec 19, 2010 at 6:37 PM

    Go after Shields (Tampa Bay), but do it without giving up Desmond and Espinosa. J. Zimmerman is not proven. We might feel better having an established starter now (Shields). Include J. Zimmerman and Morgan in the deal for Shields. Hey, are we still gonna get LaRoche and/or D. Lee for first base?

  28. NatBiscuit - Dec 19, 2010 at 6:58 PM

    I like the non-trade. Espinoza is a ROY candidate. KC made an excellent trade. Milwaukee will likely regret this for a decade – even if they hit the playoffs this year. You just can't mortgage your future for a single staring pitcher.Doesn't anybody understand what the Expos gave up for Bartolo Colon in 2002? It was Lee Stevens, Brandon Phillips, Grady Sizemore, and Cliff Lee.This would have been the same sort of thing. Too much future for not enough now.

  29. Steven Biel - Dec 19, 2010 at 7:03 PM

    I agree with Mark–if Rizzo was willing to give up Jordan Zimmermann in a deal for Greinke, that'd be hugely disappointing.

  30. Theophilus - Dec 19, 2010 at 7:13 PM

    People need to get used to seeing Desmond and Espinosa dangled in deals. The Nats farm system has a glut of middle infielders, e.g., Lombardozzi, Hague and Kobernus, and that means the guys currently in those positions at the ML level are wampum for deals for talent at other positions. I'm in agreement w/ whoever said the measure of a starting pitcher is the number of wins, because it means they guy has logged a lot of innings. The goal is to have four guys, at least, you can trot out there 31-32 times and expect to go deep in the game. You can make better use of both your bullpen and your bench if you're not bringing relievers w/ one out in the fifth or pinch hitting in the top of the sixth. I don't think Greinke has yet proved himself by that standard, and he is not shown himself to be worth giving up the farm in a trade.

  31. greg - Dec 19, 2010 at 7:22 PM

    whoah, binm. espinoza for betencourt is not a wash. betencourt is a poor (both offensively and defensively), at best, SS, who's already shown his best game. espinoza didn't set the world on fire last year offensively, but he's supposed to be a great defensive SS and has offensive potential.still glad the nats trade didn't happen if it actually had all three of those guys in the offer.

  32. Anonymous - Dec 19, 2010 at 7:29 PM

    I'm in agreement w/ whoever said the measure of a starting pitcher is the number of wins, because it means they guy has logged a lot of innings.I believe that was Mr. Rizzo.

  33. NatBiscuit - Dec 19, 2010 at 7:36 PM

    It was Rizzo who – BTW was routinely criticized for it – said that wins was the most important pitching stat. His point of course was not that stikeouts, WHIP, ERA, complete games, innings pitched etc… were not important. His point was that results matter, winners win, and looking good losing is still losing. So I agree with those who agree with those sentiments. It's why Livo routinely outperforms his statistics. He might not be able to strike out your mother but four out of five starts he will go more than 6 innings and hold the opposition to less than 4 runs. If you can score 4 or more, Livon wins. In fact Livon lost exactly 2 games in 2010 in which he gave up more than 4 runs. Point being, wins is an important statistic. There were many pitchers with better peripheral stats than Livo but he still won 10 games on a bad team.

  34. Anonymous - Dec 19, 2010 at 7:53 PM

    Agree with NatBiscuit on bottom-line pitching. Look at Moyer and Wakefield's stats, and they are not impressive. But they find ways to get the job done anyway. They win. Additionally, don't we have quite a bit of pitching that is likely to be ready by 2012 and afterwards? We're getting there, and when we do, it's going to be great.fpcsteve

  35. Cwj - Dec 19, 2010 at 7:56 PM

    I'm glad the Nats were unable to get Greinke.I wonder why Storen was on the table for a possible trade. Have the Nats soured on him?I still see him as a future good to great closer.

  36. JayB - Dec 19, 2010 at 8:04 PM

    Soren is not going to be a great closer….he is a flash in the pan as is Clippard….trade them high and you will not be sorry.

  37. sec 3 my sofa - Dec 19, 2010 at 8:17 PM

    I doubt they've soured at all–that's why other teams want him. Gotta give to get.If you can trade a maybe-closer-in-training, a shortstop you can replace, and a couple of minor-league spares, for a possible front-line starter, you do that every time. If you have to throw in your own possible #2 starter, then maybe not.But even if Storen *does* become a solid closer, and Clippard stays as good as he's been, you still take a good starter over any relievers.

  38. BinM - Dec 19, 2010 at 8:20 PM

    Anon@1:01 – Very true that the Bowden drafts may have set the team back a bit; The 2005-08 period has borne one star, and a number of fringe players, but little high-end value at the ML-level to date. He did little to help the team rebound from the MLB / Minaya years of 'gutting' the franchise in preparation for contraction. RZim is a bona-fide star, with Detwiler, Espinosa, Lannan, Stammen, JZimm on the 25-man, and Carr, Kimball, Maxwell, & Marrero on the 40-man. For better or worse, due to his period of control, the current roster (and W-L result) is still largely his responsibility. Rizzo has recovered a bit, adding Storen & Strasburg to the 25-man, and Harper to the 40-man in the last two years, but probably needs another year ot two for a fair comparison. Ten years of horrifically bad management cannot be completely undone in only six, but I'd have hoped the team would have been a little better than their W-L record has reflected since 2005. Such has not been the case. The 2011 season is fast approaching, and the team still lacks a ML-quality 1B, another LH bat in the lineup, bench help, and another top-end SP if they even hope to be interesting this year. I fear another bottom-third overall result is in the mix for 2011.

  39. BinM - Dec 19, 2010 at 8:44 PM

    @greg: I never suggested that Espinosa for Betancourt was a wash; Far from the truth. What I posted was that Escobar for Betancourt & $$ was a technical wash. One team (MIL) gives up youth & athleticism for a 'plug-in' (Betancourt) & cash.

  40. Theophilus - Dec 19, 2010 at 9:12 PM

    Storen lacks a get 'em out pitch. He's about a mile or two per hour short on his fastball, doesn't have good control of his curve, and his change-up isn't reliable. Maybe he could develop a splitter or improve the change a la Hoffman. Not ready yet to roll him out there 65 times a year and expect forty plus saves. I'm not saying I'd trade him but I wouldn't over-value him either. The idea of trades at this point should be, don't make it unless you're fully convinced it makes you better for at least two-three years.

  41. sec 3 my sofa - Dec 19, 2010 at 9:17 PM

    The problem now is as it was: they don't have a top starter who matches up with other top starters. Everybody is pushed up one, and we are looking at Livo losing 2-0 to Ubaldo Jimenez again, and that's if we're lucky. They need a top starter, they know that, they've said that, but right now, the best shot looks like praying they hit the lottery on somebody having a career year for the ages. Which could happen, sure, but I'll be sitting here to watch it.

  42. sec 3 my sofa - Dec 19, 2010 at 9:19 PM

    "Not ready yet to roll him out there 65 times a year and expect forty plus saves."I wouldn't advise counting on Sidd Fitch getting forty saves with this club.

  43. Theophilus - Dec 19, 2010 at 10:19 PM

    Sec 3 forgets that Cordero approached 40.

  44. Tim - Dec 19, 2010 at 11:04 PM

    I like storen. But a closer who cna save the win is worth alot more when you have starters who can get the win to begin with.

  45. sec 3 my sofa - Dec 19, 2010 at 11:18 PM

    Not on this team. That was 2005.

  46. Wally - Dec 20, 2010 at 12:28 AM

    Sec 3 has it right, it isn't whether our guys are good or not. If they weren't, they wouldn't have value. But, assuming everyone involved is good, if you can trade a bullpen arm or two plus a MI, especially when you have organizational depth in those areas, for a starter, you have to do it. Especially when you need starters. But that is also why they shouldn't trade JZimm.Didn't work for greinke; they should try for garza (or Shields) and do it if the trade make up is similar. Probably not going to happen there either, so we should be prepared that for 2011 we'll be going with what we have plus maybe a mediocre guy or a reclamation project.There is an encouraging side to the almost trade, though. If they got to the point of asking for a waiver of Greinke's 'no trade', it meant that our guys were attractive enough for someone like him. That is actually a pretty significant point. Since we fans usually value our own guys too highly, this gives us some external validation of the progress being made in the system. I hoped that the chance to pitch with Strasburg in 2012 would have been a draw for Greinke, but I guess not yet.

  47. waddu eye no - Dec 20, 2010 at 1:03 AM

    the good news? i'm watching the 1960 final series game, and i'm a kid again. baseball does that.berra and skowron on ,'s like opera. i know the ending going in, but the process is a thrill.

  48. Anonymous - Dec 20, 2010 at 1:21 AM

    I do not know what people are talking about, the Brewers gave up one major leaguer and a bunch of probably won't be's, maybe the equivalent of our A or AA players. The real story here is Rizzo offered TWO major leaguers who are probably the highest ceiling of our youngsters and he gets a PASS…FU Rizzo

  49. Anonymous - Dec 20, 2010 at 1:42 AM

    Greinke vetoed Rizzo's deal with Royals.

  50. Anonymous - Dec 20, 2010 at 2:02 AM

    8:21Pudding head…

  51. SonnyG10 - Dec 20, 2010 at 2:04 AM

    I am also glad the trade didn't happen for the reasons so well stated by the other bloggers here. I really have confidence that Rizzo and the Learners will build us a good team and I anxiously await their other moves. I know they are trying very hard to improve the team and that's what I most care about.

  52. greg - Dec 20, 2010 at 4:40 AM

    i guess i'm confused about what the real difference is between a "wash" and a "technical wash." ===One way to de-construct the trade is Greinke for three players (Cain, Jeffress & Odorizzi); The shortstops (Escobar for Betancourt) & $2M are technically a wash===that sounds to me like you're discounting escobar and betencourt because they're both SSs and saying the trade is really the other three for greinke. if they were actually even, that would make sense to me.

  53. Another_Sam - Dec 20, 2010 at 11:12 AM

    Right on, Mr. Z, regarding your analogy showing too much to give in trade, Also right on: " . . .But the Brewers have a better chance of winning in 2011 and 2012 than the Nationals . . ." I wasn't as sure of this until I saw your posited rotation. Sadly, any rotation that relies on Lannan as a front line starter is a bit less that contending, IMHO.

  54. Anonymous - Dec 20, 2010 at 11:21 AM

    Getting Greinke would not have made a difference. Our SPs are so lousy, Greinke would have been the only reliable starter good for what, maybe 15 wins? (that's good these days). We have to flounder one more year. Then, maybe, in 2012 we get to .500

  55. Doc - Dec 20, 2010 at 11:43 AM

    Let's hope that Greinke does for the Brewers, what Bartolo Colon did for the Expos—deplete their prospects pool(All Stars: Grady Sizemore, Brandon Phillips, and Cliff Lee). One of the worst trades ever in the history of baseball (often quoted by the noble commenters to this blog), Minaya was yet rewarded with the Mets GM job. Somebody must not have understood how bad he was—it took them 8 years, after the trade, to kick his ass down the street. I don't know what the future brings for Storen, Espinosa, and Zimmermann, but I'd like to think that it will be greater, both collectively and individually, than Greinke's!

  56. Carl in 309 - Dec 20, 2010 at 12:59 PM

    I suspect the next big move by the Nats will not be on the starting pitcher front but at 1st base. That Greinke (for whatever reason) was not available to the Nats suggests that there is a challenge to getting a trade for starting pitching done at this stage of the off-season. I think the focus now shifts to the (even larger) hole the Nats have at 1st.The commenting consensus here is that Greinke was neither the right guy nor available at the right price–I share that response. I'd rather not offer up what looks to be our future middle-infield, a prized bullpen draftee, AND a potentially promising front-line pitcher for another pitcher–even a Cy Young winner.I'm more interested in our closing out the free agent part of the process with a reliable first baseman and then use the time between now and March 30th to trade for a quality (though not necessarily ace) starter.

  57. NatsJack in Florida - Dec 20, 2010 at 1:24 PM

    Why do people fail to understand that Greineke TURNED DOWN THE TRADE TO THE NATS! Kansas City's first choice was to send him to us for our package over the Brewers package. What is so hard to understand about that?Our prospects were more desirable than Milwaukees prospects. I prefer to watch players develope their careers in lieu of JayB who apparently heads up the group of people that forsee the future for everyone else.I get a real kick out of a guy who constantly complains about the business accumen of the Lerners, yet pours his own cash into their cofers over and over again like 07, 08, 09 and 2010. Keep the money coming JayB so the rest of us can enjoy the return of baseball to DC.

  58. Anonymous - Dec 20, 2010 at 3:18 PM

    Amazing that we can attract Jayson Werth but not Zach Greinke, I think after the winter Meetings, even he saw that the emperor has no clothes and that Werth wass a singular move meant to seel tickets to the DC sheep who will buy anything! 😦

  59. Steve M. - Dec 20, 2010 at 3:49 PM

    Greinke is a head case and the Brewers came in 3rd place last year and Greinke won't help them do any better than that. Greinke will be traded again on July 31, 2012 to a playoff contender if he can show that he is any good. Personally I am hoping he is a big bust!This guy had 1 really good season otherwise on a Playoff calibre team he is a #3 starter. It is laughable how people are taking sides and I am really disappointed in Rizzo willing to sell off the future for this knucklehead.We are so lucky Cranky Greinke vetoed the deal! If Rizzo were smart, he should trade one of the Nats back of the rotation starters for Lorenzo Cain as the Royals need starters!

  60. Ballinonabudget - Dec 20, 2010 at 4:16 PM

    Nats sign Rick Ankiel. Ladson says he will compete with Bernadina for the starting LF job.

  61. erocks33 - Dec 20, 2010 at 4:26 PM

    I'm with you NatsJack. I don't get how people are ticked off at Rizzo for not getting Greinke, even though it was reported that the Royals AGREED to the deal but that it was nixed by Grienke himself. I just don't see how this is Rizzo's fault.Regardless, I don't care what they need to do to get a good SP in here for 2011, but they do need to get one. However they do it, though, should NOT involve trading away Jordan Zimmermann. Again, I'm perplexed as to why any Nats fan would be okay with trading him. In his fist season (2009), he put up some good numbers. In 16 starts (91.1 IP), he went 3-5 with a 4.63 ERA and 1.36 WHiP. Sure, those aren't Cy Young caliber numbers, but look at the other stats and you'll see some great promise: 9.07 K/9; 2.86 BB/9; 3.39xFIP and had a 1.8 WAR. Besides Strasburg, is there anyone else on the Nats roster that has the potential to put up numbers like this?What stunk was that he got hurt at the end of 2009 and obviously wasn't 100% when he pitched at the end of 2010 (which, IMO, he shouldn't have done. they should have left him in the minors).When healthy, as he should be in Viera, Zimmermann will start to pitch like a true #2 for the Nats. And he's locked in for like the next 5 years under the Nats. Why any of you would like to get rid of this is beyond me.

  62. JD - Dec 20, 2010 at 4:26 PM

    Steve M.Greinke is not a head case; he has social anxiety disorder and if you don't realize that he is a top echelon pitcher in his mid 20's who can be lead a rotation along with Strasburg and Zimmermann then you are not paying attention. He did not have one lucky year; everyone in the business knows how good he is.

  63. Sec 3 MySofa - Dec 20, 2010 at 5:48 PM

    They didn't say he only had one lucky year, they said he only had one good year. "Wasn't luck, but don't count on repeating it" being the takeaway there.Anxiety disorders are a b., indeed, but the strike zone is what it is regardless. If "everyone in the business knows how good he is," I would think they'd have gotten more and better offers.

  64. Anonymous - Dec 20, 2010 at 9:34 PM

    Here is my question: If Grienke is that good, why on earth were the Royals hellbent to get rid of him when they controlled him for 2 more years? If good SP's are the sine qua non of baseball, why would they trade a CY winner? Having listened to the Royals on the local radio station for the last year, unless things go just right in Milwaukee, I think the Brewers will have a case of buyer's remorse sooner than later.fpcsteve





As ESPN-980 AM's Nats Insider, Mark makes daily appearances on the station's various shows. Here's the 2015 schedule (subject to change)...

MON: 12:45 p.m.
TUE: 2:30 p.m.
WED: 4:30 p.m.
THU: 2:30 p.m.
FRI: 5:30 p.m.
SAT: 10:30 a.m.

*All times Eastern. You can also listen to the station on 94.3 FM, 92.7 FM and online at Click here for past audio clips.

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